Monthly Archives: June 2007

When Real Estate Agent & Rehab Investor Meet There Will Be Frustration

An ongoing conversation in the field of real estate investing is the working relationship between the real estate agent and the rehab investor. Or flipper as some of you would say. Christopher Smith of Equity Scout wrote an article titled Realtors and Investors :: Are you speaking the same language?

First, let me just say that Christopher Smith is probably one of the best bloggers out there on his subject. I love his stuff and the thinking he makes me do. Christopher is an investor. I am an agent. So I answered the post with my own titled Real Estate Investor vs. Real Estate Agent: What’s A Quality Investment Property? In a great many ways I think my post supported his.

Last night I received yet another comment on the post. A recurring theme in the ongoing relationship between agent and rehabber. Frustration.

Rehabber’s Point of View ( I believe)

The rehabber needs properties with enough margin between the ARV (after repair value) and the acquisition costs for him to successfully rehab the house AND cover his acquisition costs AND cover his carrying costs AND to make a profit.

Real Estate Agent’s Point of View

Many newer rehabbers will try to rely on real estate agents to find them. Good luck. I’ve said a million times over the phone that there is not a search I can do for houses that are for sale for 45%, 50% or 60% of ARV. If, on occasion, I stumble across one that the listing agent wasn’t smart enough to buy for himself I will either move on it myself or reward one of the rehabbers already on my list.

The rehabber turns to the agents because if he can get the agent to find these homes for him (rather than doing what successful rehabbers do and that is find the houses themselves through obituaries and NODs) then his job is easier.

The agent (the newer ones anyway) like the idea of working with these rehabbers because they will sell 8-10 houses a year to them, guaranteed!

Well, probably not. The agent will spend hours upon hours searching through the MLS and previewing homes they THINK will work because they do not fully understand the business of rehabbing. Then they will take the rehabber out on tour.

The rehabber gets frustrated because the agent isn’t understanding him and not showing him properties that he can make a profit on. Not when the pencil and paper meet. (Or worse, he doesn’t do the pencil and paper and is a candidate for the next NOD.)

The agent, after showing 20 houses and many sleepless nights covering the MLS, finally says “I’m not working with investors because they are never happy and never buy anything.”

The rehabber says “Agents don’t want to work with us because all they care about is a quick commission.”

Neither side is fully right. Neither side is fully wrong.

For me and my business, I work with mostly Buy & Hold real estate investors. I do have a couple of clients that rehab properties. And like I said earlier, I have a hard enough time finding them enough to keep them satisfied throughout the year. And by satisfied I mean I find them 1-2 a year. I do that for a couple different people. That’s about it. And I KNOW what a rehabber needs. There just aren’t many out there.

The relationship between real estate agent and rehabber can work. But both sides need to fully understand each other, their motivations, their criteria and the results they expect.

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Nothing To Do With Real Estate or Investing

This post has nothing to do with real estate or investing. In fact, it has nothing to do with Kansas City. Rather, it’s simply to point out that once in a while evil lawyers can be defeated with their own nonsense.

I guess this attorney should have hired Alan Shore.

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Real Estate Investing Q&A : Personal Stories

Today I would like to fully introduce you to a real estate investor client of mine even though modesty on his part has restricted me giving you his full name. I have worked for Al S. for a little longer than a year now.

When you read his answers to these real estate investing questions please notice that his whole economic picture today is more comfortable than most people’s. And he didn’t own hundreds of income properties. In fact, he owned fewer than ten rental homes.

Q: How long have you been investing in real estate? 50 years.

Q: What made you purchase your first house? Upon being discharged from Air Force after the Korean War I got married and used the GI Bill to buy a duplex and lived in one side. The tenant advised me that I should not buy the place because it was a dump and not worth the price they were asking. Well, he bought the dump for me with his rent payments and I moved up to a nicer dump while he remained living there paying rent for many more years.

Q: Did you know what you were doing or did you just jump in? Owning rental income property runs in my family. My dad supplemented his seasonal job with income from rental property income. My brother and sister also became involved in rental properties. Both of them have been more aggressive investors than I. My sister owned a city block of rentals in New York and my brother owned several nice Westchester New York properties. Both have since divested their holdings to spend more time traveling.I am also in the process of doing the same.

Q: What has been your biggest headache over the years? Not buying more properties. Like the saying goes “Get lots when your young”.

Q: Were there months you were worried you would not have enough money? Fortunately by picking good properties and selecting good tenants the cash flow was usually enough to cover expenses. There was one occasion when a property I purchase with owner financing at 7% had a 5 year balloon payment due. Refinancing rates had climbed to 19 % at the time the balloon payment was due. The rental income would not support such an interest rate so my offer was to let the former owner take the property back. He thought that he would prefer to continue collecting 7% for another 5 years as better deal for both of us. When the next balloon date arrived, interest rates returned to a reasonable level allowing me to refinance through a bank.

Q: Name your biggest reward over the years of your investing. Good cash flow; good appreciation; good tax shelter to save income taxes on my day job ; plus providing a goods service to good people in need of a good place to live.

Q: Did you realize what your income properties would be worth some day? There was always the fear that property values might drop as well as the wish that they would go up, up and away. Just like any other risk-reward adventure there is excitement in taking the risk. Real Estate has been one of my better investments from both a financial as well as a feeling of personal accomplishment. My other investments, such as stocks, have had some financial results but lacked the personal feeling of accomplishment because the results were the actions of others. Owning,managing and controlling an entire investment, like a real estate investment, is an entrepreneurial adventure.

Q: You chose to just liquidate your properties. Why did you decide to not utilize the IRC 1031 tax deferred exchange? 1031 exchanges are a good tool to use to make full utilization of sales proceeds by delaying the tax consequences to a later date. But like the saying goes “you can pay Uncle Sam now or pay uncle Sam later, but you will pay Uncle Sam.” I chose to pay Uncle Sam now and taking what was left over to enjoy traveling and eating good meals while I am young enough to do so.

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This Explains A Lot

According to this link from Yahoo! I really am smarter than everybody else. Er, check that. At least smarter than my siblings. Er, well, I’m the smartest in my own mind… 🙂

Now the next thing you know they are gonna find is that Kansas Jayhawks are smarter than Missouri Tigers. Start the hate mail, now.

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Kansas City, Missouri Rental Licensing

I received this email from KCRAR. That’s Kansas City Regional Association of REALTORS. I am in full agreement that we do not want, nor do we need rental licensing in Kansas City, MO for investment property owners and/or their rental properties.

Now, I’m not for slum lords, either. So as you read this be sure to understand that most of my clients keep clean and relatively updated units in operation and available to their tenants. There are already measures that could be put in force to make sure tenant living quarters are safe and clean. Use those.

And before KCMO decides to go after the landlords, why don’t they first go after themselves. I’ve never seen a more disorganized and incompetent housing authority in all my life as the experiences I’ve had with the Kansas City Housing Authority. I guess they want landlords to do what they cannot. Hmmmmm.

The Kansas City, Missouri City Council is considering a proposal to create a rental licensing program for landlords in KCMO, including registration fees, inspection requirements, and other costly and cumbersome regulations. KCRAR opposes such programs, as we believe they unfairly target investment property owners, do very little to address the problem of blight in neighborhoods, discourage investment in rental properties, and increase the cost of housing to lower income tenants who are most at risk of losing their shelter.

Please help us fight this proposal by contacting members of the Kansas City MO Public Safety and Neighborhood Committee and adding your voice to our opposition.

Thank you.

Send a letter to the following decision maker(s):

Council Member Cathy Jolly
Council Member Cindy Circo
Council Member John Sharp
Council Member Melba Curls
Council Member Sharon Sanders Brooks

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Learning From The Past: Moving Forward

Real estate investing can be a humbling business. Stray to far from sound economic guidelines and sooner or later, it seems, you will pay the price. Then what do you do?

Another real estate agent from Nebraska and I were speaking through email last week. He had been burned big time by his real estate investing endeavours earlier in his life. When the Carter/Reagan years hit he lost everything…including his word as he had to file for bankruptcy.

In his early years it came easy and he continued to expand his parameters on what risk he would take on. When inflation shot to 18% he was doomed.

He wallowed in doubt and self pity for a while. Then took a hard look around. He was 41 years old without any formal secondary education and just a real estate license. There were no high paying surgeon jobs out there for people without medical degrees and the same was true with most professions he thought about.

Finally, he set back on the bath of building wealth through real estate. “A common man’s vehicle” I think he said. It was tough. Every time he gathered a little money he would buy something else. This time however every property had to pencil. And pencil with conservative numbers.

No overnight success stories. Just 22 years more of hard work, balancing acts, tough choices and self-denial. And yet, here he sits. A millionaire again.

We all get slapped in the face once in a while. What are you going to do about it? Quit?

A former United State Marine once told me, while I was wallowing in my own self pity, “FIDO, man.”

Forget It. Drive On.

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I’m Confused

I have to say I’m a little confused. I keep hearing on the television and some other real estate agents that the housing market is slowing down. Why am I getting busier? Oh, I’m not complaining. No, no, no. I’m just saying that it seems to getting busier, at least for me.

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A fellow agent of mine let me know she has a developer out in Shawnee that is going to be releasing 95 (I think that was the number) build able lots this weekend. If you are a builder or investor interested in such a project, let me know.

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If you are looking for homes that can be purchased at 50% of ARV, please no more calls. I have enough people on my list unhappy with me as it is. Folks, these properties don’t grow on trees. Now if you are looking for Rehab & Hold properties or rental homes or longer term investment properties…opportunities abound. Buy & Hold real estate investing is where to go, now. The short term gains are tougher to find.

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